Month: October 2023

On October 27, Karan Thapar interviewed Dr. Khamis Elessi, a Palestinian doctor at Shifa Hospital in Gaza, which is now reduced to rubble under Israeli bombardment. Dr. Elessi says there are zero stocks of many essential and life-saving drugs, and with no space available in hospitals, doctors are treating patients on the floor, in the corridors, and in alleyways. Due to depleted stocks of anesthesia and oxygen and with no promise of new stocks coming in, he says they are forced to perform surgeries without anesthesia.

With buildings reduced to rubble and no one picking up piles of garbage for days on end, he says infections have already started spreading in Gaza. Lack of drinking water is spiking renal infections, and local authorities are forced to supply only highly salinated sea water to civilians, according to the doctor.

Dr. Elessi says more than supplying food and medicine to Gazans, the world must immediately stop this war. He specifically urges Prime Minister Narendra Modi to stand by the people of Palestine. The below is full transcript of the interview, and it has been lightly edited for style and clarity.

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Hello and welcome to a special interview for The Wire. We’re joined today by Dr Khamis Elessi, a Palestinian doctor and a specialist in pain management and rehabilitation. He joins us from Shifa Hospital in Khan Yunis, which is in the southern part of the Gaza Strip.

Dr. Elessi, can I start by asking you, first tell me what are conditions like in the Shifa Hospital from where you’re joining us? 

Yeah, Shifa, first of all, Shifa Hospital is located in Gaza City. It’s in the southern part of Gaza City. Yeah, it’s in the southern part of Gaza City. Yeah, the situation in the Shifa hospital is very, very dramatic. Shifa Hospital is the biggest hospital in Palestine and in the Gaza Strip, with more than 700 beds capacity. It is the main provider of healthcare for almost 70% to 80% of all Palestinians in Gaza and this hospital is providing acute care and chronic care for all patients, including patients who have renal dialysis and patients who need surgery and other things.

Unfortunately, prior to the war, Gaza hospitals had zero stocks of more than 50% of all essential drugs. That was before the war but after the war, the situation even got worse. So the remaining 50% is also absent and with the closure of all borders, all inlets to Gaza, the situation is becoming very, very dire, with a huge number of casualties that have been caused. Whatever remains of the disposables medicines, and medical devices doctors are running in very, very primitive ways of managing acute pains, acute injuries, and these things.

Till this moment, we have more than 7200 individuals who were killed in the Gaza Strip and more than 18,500 who were injured, let alone the 1,600 people who are still missing under the rubble. Till this moment we have more than 1,600 Palestinians or even more still missing under the rubble of their homes. Why? Because there is no fuel for cars or big bulldozers to remove the debris, there are no lights, no electricity, no water, no nothing and it’s dangerous for civil defence and ambulances to reach these houses because they will be bombed, unfortunately.

Tell me first Dr. Elessi, how many people are sheltering in the Shifa Hospital and how many patients do you have as against the capacity officially that you’re supposed to have? 

In fact, the capacity of Shifa Hospital is full. In fact, it is overflowing. In fact, yesterday I witnessed that all doctors in the emergency department were treating their patients on the ground because so many patients are coming with no beds to care for them, and within the corridors, within the walls, within the parks of the hospital there are between 20,000 and 30,000 individuals who are sheltering inside the hospital. Why? Simply Gaza Strip is a tiny piece of land for our beloved viewers in India and elsewhere. Gaza Strip is the most densely populated area worldwide with a density percentage of around 5,700 individuals per square kilometers, so it is more dense than China, more dense than Hong Kong, it’s more dense than New Delhi.

Let me continue this point, so 2.3 million, when they were asked to move from the northern part of Gaza to the southern part of Gaza, many people, including myself, tried to go there but we found that the shelling and bombing in that areas is even more intense than Gaza and we decided, ‘okay we will just go to a safer place in Gaza Strip’ and we will go back to our homes which is maybe, could be away from shelling. But, unfortunately shelling is everywhere and killing is everywhere, so people are running away for their lives. Almost 125,000 tons of ammunition have been dropped in Gaza which is a tiny piece of land, only 360 square kilometers area.  

Let me just clarify you said that initially, you moved from the north, from Gaza City to the South but because the shelling to the South was continuing, you weren’t safe and you had nowhere to stay. You went back to Gaza and I should correct myself, the Shifa hospital is in Gaza City not in Khan Yunis. You returned to the north, is that right? 

No, actually I moved four places because I’m residing in Tel al-Hawa.  I’m residing in Tel al-Hawa and the Tel al-Hawa or Rimal neighbourhood was completely devastated by the bombing of those High Towers because I’m living in the center of that area, which is an area you would say for the elite. It’s a modern area for people who are professionals, who are educated, who are well-off. So they reside in this area, unfortunately, that area was completely devastated, including the square of the President himself, President Mahmoud Abbas. We have a square near our home called the President’s Intersection where the president’s home is. There, it’s only five minutes from our place but unfortunately, that area was completely devastated.

More than 25 towers and buildings were demolished so we ran away to our old home, my old home and all. Also, the shelling was very, very intense. Their deaths are in the hundreds, so we moved to the middle zone of Gaza, thinking that it will be safer and we found that the shelling is even worse. So I decided I’d go back and live with my family in our original home. But from time to time I’m coming here to Shifa to assist my friends in caring for acutely ill patients. Our colleagues have been extremely exhausted, imagine working for 20 days straight with no break, no stop, dealing with more than 22,000. 

Let me, while the line exists, ask you a few specific questions so you can give me a few specific answers. Do you have things like anesthesia and oxygen? Do you have workable operating theaters or is all of that shut? 

In some hospitals, they still have some anesthesia, especially for operations. But for milder operations, they do it without anesthesia, unfortunately. Because there is too much pressure and there are no available devices, no available medicines to care for patients in the corridors. This is one thing. In other hospitals, they run out of sutures to close wounds because Israelis are using these kind of sophisticated weapons that causes hundreds of cut-wounds in the body just like cutting the bodies into pieces, which consumes all the suture and causes severe burns. I’ve noticed so many cases and also was told by many of my senior friends who work with burns that for the first time, they see such kinds of burns and damage to the skin. The skin is cut into pieces just like you cut it with a knife and burned completely. 

Are they using phosphorus? Do you have any signs of phosphorus?

Yes, they’re using phosphorus and there are so many witnesses. I haven’t seen it for myself. I cannot confirm it myself but we have so many witnesses and so many doctors who confirm that they have dealt with cases of white phosphorus. Actually, to be honest, in 2009 I published a paper in the Cochrane Library, talking about phosphorus and the injuries I’ve seen with some of the patients, similar to the description that we have seen in 2009 and 2012. 

Now, I can see that at the moment you have electricity but how often does Shifa Hospital have electricity, and more importantly, do you have clean water? 

Okay, Shifa Hospital has no electricity, and now they are running on generators. Unfortunately, within 24 hours or 40-48 hours, electricity will be shut down and no more patients will be admitted. 

And what about water? Do you have clean water? 

Also no, unfortunately, we are drinking. This is actually a point I wanted to raise. Yes, we have 7,000 patients who were killed, 7,000 victims who were murdered and 20,000 people who were injured with their kids and their families. But we have 300,000 Palestinians who are dying in silence because they suffer from chronic illnesses and need their care. But they’re not receiving it because of the inability to access hospital care in the primary health care centers. Inability to come to hospitals in the main hospitals, inability to commute because there are no cars and everybody is scared for their life. This is one thing.

Another thing just yesterday the mayor of Gaza, Nizar Hijazi, announced that because there is no water in Gaza, they have decided to use seawater. See, it’s highly salinated water. There is no water in our aquifer, so decided they would use these wells which were closed 10 years ago because of the high salinity, and high salt content. They decided, okay, we will open it for the people. This poses a high danger for people to cause renal failure and many problems in their blood because of the high salinity of this water. Not only this, but also because of lack of fuel, there is no sewage management, so they are directly bumping this sewage water and dirty water into the sea which causes pollution of the sea, killing marine life.

A third thing is that cancer patients who need this chemotherapy and radiotherapy are not receiving it. We have 11,000 patients with adrenal needs who need, sorry, 1,200 patients who need regular renal dialysis and they are not receiving it regularly. So this poses a danger to their lives. 

Tell me you said in 24 hours, the fuel at Shifa Hospital will stop. What then will happen to babies in incubators?  What will happen to people on ventilators? What will happen to people who need dialysis, are they all destined to die?  

Many of them will die. Fortunately, maybe five years ago, they installed on top of ICUs, some solar panels. These solar panels can save some patients who are in ventilators but patients who need who needed renal dialysis, blood transfusion like sickle cell anemia like patients, who suffer from blood disorders, patients who need plasmapheresis for any neurological disease, like we’ve seen for neurological disease, like patients who have sickle cell anemia and patients who suffer from other diseases, they will not be able to receive any treatments because of lack of power. Not only that in Gaza, they have I think two main oxygen stations which are running on power. Without electricity, those oxygen stations will stop and many patients will be at risk of death because of lack of oxygen. 

Dr Elessi, describe to me the conditions in the city around you. I’ll point out that you’re in Gaza which is in the northern half of the Gaza Strip, what are the conditions like in Gaza?

Okay, to be precise, I’m in the southern part of Gaza because the northern part of Gaza is more towards the Nasser area. But, I’m in the southern part of Gaza. So in this area, you go out to Gaza and you think you’re living in a ghost city. Piles and piles of garbage, which have not been collected for the last 10 days or more which pose environmental hazards to people. We have people lining up for bread at bakeries. For lines, let’s say 400 individuals, 500 individuals falling in line just to get one bag of bread to feed their families, people are falling in lines just to get one bottle of water for 2 hours, 3 hours. So situation on the ground is disastrous.

I want to use this this time to send a message through your kind channel that the people here, despite their hunger, their thirst, do not want only food or water, they want the war to stop. I hope that the Indian Prime Minister, the Indian government will use its influence to put an end to this onslaught because people who are dying are civilians. I don’t care if Israel will fight militants and they fight each other for years but unfortunately, the ones who are paying the prices are the children, you see.

Thousands, thousands upon thousands, they received cuts, one’s eyes removed, skulls removed, these are very, very dramatic, very emotional when you see kids. We have 69 families who have been completely wiped out from the civil registry – what we need – not only food, yes, we need food, we need water, we need electricity but we need to stop this slaughter now and stop it now. 

Dr. Elessi, tell me what is the sort of destruction done by the air strikes? Are large parts of where you are demolished? Is it just rubble, have buildings been demolished?

It’s just you go in Gaza, more than 200,000 homes have been demolished, more than 200,000. So you go everywhere, whole squares, whole blocks are devastated. In fact, yesterday they attacked one block, killing 300 individuals in less than 10 seconds. Seven buildings have been completely dropped on top of their residences, killing till now they have retrieved 120 bodies and they say there are still more than 120 or 150 bodies underneath the rubble.

Because they don’t have the equipment to remove these rubble there are many people who are trapped under the rubble who may be alive but will die under the rubble. Exactly because some of them have been trapped there for more than 10 days and now they die of hunger and suffocation. This fumes, this kind of fire made by these huge bombs. The bombs, my dear, are making gigantic sounds, supersonic explosions that even can stop the heart. We have many, many people who come with cardiac arrest just because there is too much scare and fear inside their hearts and they just fall down dead, right away. 

Tell me this, Dr. Elessi, with a severe shortage of water, with electricity disappearing very quickly, with fuel in short supply, probably ending, and with garbage all around, is there a fear of disease spreading? Could you have epidemics, Cholera, for example?

Yes, in fact, the Minister of Health reported yesterday that they documented more than 4,500 cases of skin diseases that are due to overcrowding. Actually, while you’re walking in the hospital, hundreds and thousands of people, you can hear most of the kids coughing. So, we have an upsurge of respiratory tract infections, among all of them. And if one of them is infected, this will cause infection among thousands because they are backed, backed one next to the other people. Even this causes danger to the hospital itself because the hospital is no longer becoming a hygienic place. This will cause infection to the residents and to the people who seek refuge because the hospital itself, as you know, has most of the powerful potent germs, viruses, and bacteria. So those patients when they are seeking refuge inside the hospital corridors and in the parks and in the alleyways and roads. They are at high risk of getting these infections and causing death indirectly to their friends and relatives.

Tell me something, is it now impossible for people to have a daily bath? Has personal hygiene, as a result of the conditions suffered, thus endangering people from that as well even doctors?

Even doctors, they could barely go to the toilet, I mean once a day or maybe have a shower once every 5 days or 6 days, because there is no water and there’s a lack of space for you. You go to your home, it’s in danger of being bombed, you go to the streets, you are in danger of being bombed. So it’s really hard and again, this will cause environmental hazards on the people’s lives and their children and their families. Most families here have extended families, so people gather together, the friends, the brothers, the sisters, all live in one place and then here comes the huge, two-ton bombs dropped on that building killing everybody inside and leaving a few people injured. But the rest will be killed underneath.  

How worried are you about a ground invasion which Israel has repeatedly said will happen but we don’t know when? Although it’s widely believed, it could be soon. How worried are people about that?

People are so worrie, but they are more worried about the lack of humanity. They’re more worried about the absence of morals among world leaders when they said ‘okay, we’ll think about sending some food packages for the Gaza people’. Maybe tomorrow, maybe next week, always remember because I witnessed the first day of the war in Ukraine and when the first Ukrainian person was injured, two people were injured, The European Union, America, Britain opened their borders completely, gave Ukrainians all they need, gave them the money, gave them the food, gave them residence, gave them refuge, gave them shelter.

Here in Gaza, we are in a closed, big prison and we are being bombed from the sea, land, and the earth. The sea, land, and earth, over the hour- 24/7, this killing machine never stopped. That’s why, it’s not me, I was trained in an Israeli Hospital one year in 2000, I spent one year in Sheba Medical Center and I have treated so many Israeli patients. They respected- those patients of mine and my Israeli teachers, they respected me and they think that we have so many friends in Palestine. But unfortunately, those people who are thinking wisely and thinking like humans are few. Now the one who are calling for war and more killing is the extremist, far extremist. 

My last question, Dr. Elessi, in this traumatic situation how is the morale of the people? Like in Gaza, talk about those around you, what is their morale like? What is their spirit or are they beginning to lose hope? 

How is the morale? The morale is high because we think if we die, we are martyrs. We will be going to heaven but unfortunately, we are scared for our families, for our kids, because they got nothing to do, they got nothing, they have committed no crime. The vast majority of people killed are women and children. The vast majority are women and children, they’ve committed nothing and as I told you, if Israel wants to fight with the militants, let them fight for years and years but don’t come next to the civilians, because civilians are just people, just seeking refuge in their homes, that home they have their memories, their stories, their loved one. They grow up in that home, they have built it with blood and their tears for over 50 years and now you’re dropping it on top of them, killing all of them in less than five seconds. This is what really people, and I hope that the Indian government will use its pressure to stop this war alongside other people with a conscience. 

Dr. Elessi, you said a very important thing a moment ago, you said let them hit the militants. Has a separation emerged between Hamas and the ordinary people of Gaza that was hinted at? 

I’m not a politician, and I’m not a military. I’m a doctor. What I know, what I’m saying is that you can distinguish between a child who is seven years old, a woman who’s sleeping in their home, and any militant. Of course, any same person can distinguish. So why do you kill this woman? You know that people are sleeping in their homes and you drop these bombs on buildings. So I’m not here to distinguish. I’m here to tell you that one demand only, avoid civilians, avoid children, avoid women, they got nothing to do, they got nothing to do with this war on Gaza. They are the ones who are paying the price and they are the ones who are dying, unfortunately.  

And your message to my Prime Minister Narendra Modi is to do everything to stop the Israelis from killing innocents and women. 

Yes, I know he’s a very influential man, I know he’s a vocal man, I know he says what he thinks in his heart, so I hope he will say it, and our Indian brothers and sisters, we have high admiration for Indian culture, Indian democracy and we hope that Prime Minister, the Indian government, will put all their pressure to stop this war and stop it for good. We don’t want you only to give us food and to continue killing our people, our children. We want this war to stop and stop for good. No more wars and the only solution is a peaceful solution. The vast majority of Palestinian people, including myself, want to live in peace, side by side with our Israeli brothers and sisters. We don’t want to kill each other, we want to live side by side, according to the International Law 1997, borders with Jerusalem for two states, for two nations and to live in peace. What’s wrong with that? Why can’t we live in peace and live in harmony and be prosperous nations and developed nations instead of killing each other? 

 I hear that very clearly and I’ll repeat it for the audience your message to Narendra Modi is to use your instruments to stop this war, and ensure that innocent women and children are not killed. And then you added, Dr. Elessi, we want to live in peace, side by side, with our Israeli brothers. Stop this war.  

Yes, we are all, we are all cousins, we all came from the same Prophet. So I hope, my final message is to stop this war and start working for a lasting, just, peace that gives Palestinians their rights of self-determination and their Palestinian state. We are the only occupied nation in the whole world and I hope that world leaders will work to end this occupation because it is the root cause of this problem. It’s not only the fighting and the militants. The root cause is the occupation. Once you finish the occupation, I think people will live in peace and that peace needs to be just peace. There are no two levels, there is no apartheid, and there are no masters and slaves. We live on an equal basis, we have our Palestinian state with Jerusalem as its capital and we live in peace and harmony with our brothers and sisters in Israel. Our brothers and sisters in America, India, Britain, and we should be dealt with as equal citizens, equals individuals in this world not as inferior citizens who can be killed and nobody’s paying any attention for our lives, unfortunately.  

Dr. Elessi, I thank you for making time to speak to me. I wish you not just good luck but safety. Take care, take care of your patients, take care of your family and God be with you.  

Thank you, thank you, thank you.